I use the Strava App. for my training/heartrate/speed. I am doing my first H.Im this weekend. I know I can not use headphones or music in any way, but can I have the phone on my bars..(No Music or voice prompts) just as a mapping, speed device? Same function as a GPS watch or cycle computer..? Yes/No? USAT 3.4 does not say anything really close to this other than MP3 & other music playing devices.
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Re: Computer on IPhone [trycrzb]
[ In reply to ]
Nope. An iPhone is, among other things, a personal audio device.
Rodney
TrainingPeaks | Altra Running | RAD Roller
http://www.goinglong.ca
Rodney
TrainingPeaks | Altra Running | RAD Roller
http://www.goinglong.ca
Re: Computer on IPhone [trycrzb]
[ In reply to ]
An argument could be made that it is permissible to use an iPhone in this situation, i.e. as a bike computer and not an audio device.
Rule 3.4(l) provides:
Since an iPhone is many things, including a personal audio device, it would seem clear that it is prohibited. However, if you look at the rules more closely you find the following in Rule 1.3:
Construction[/url]. These Rules shall be interpreted and construed in a manner consistent with their purpose.
So, if we look back at Rule 3.4(l) and consider the purpose of the rule (i.e. ban the use of audio devices) an argument can be made that any use of an iPhone soley as a bike computer and not an audio device is within the rules.
I've made a similar argument on more than one occasion to a race official about the rule regarding alteration of race numbers - 3.4(f):
Race Numbers. Participants shall plainly display their race numbers at all times, and shall maintain the race number in an unaltered, unobstructed and readable state at the start and finish gates, in the transition areas, and on the course
Some officials get hungup on the "unaltered" portion of the rule and frown if you trim a number sticker so it fits better on your bike. As I've explained, the purpose of the rule is to prohibit folks from changing their number in such a way that they can not be properly identified on the course. If I do nothing more than trim the excess material but my assigned race number is still clearly identifiable I'm following the rules. I've yet to be penalized for doing this and it's come up mutliple times.
Btw, I've never made that iPhone argument and I probably would never try. There's too much room for abuse on that one and I can see the official not trusting you to not turn on some tunes once you're out on the bike course.
p.s. I'm a lawyer as if that was hard to tell.
Rule 3.4(l) provides:
Quote:
Unauthorized Accessories. No participant shall, at any time during the event, use or wear a hard cast, headset, radio, personal audio device, or any other item deemed dangerous by the Head Referee.Since an iPhone is many things, including a personal audio device, it would seem clear that it is prohibited. However, if you look at the rules more closely you find the following in Rule 1.3:
Quote:
Construction[/url]. These Rules shall be interpreted and construed in a manner consistent with their purpose.
So, if we look back at Rule 3.4(l) and consider the purpose of the rule (i.e. ban the use of audio devices) an argument can be made that any use of an iPhone soley as a bike computer and not an audio device is within the rules.
I've made a similar argument on more than one occasion to a race official about the rule regarding alteration of race numbers - 3.4(f):
Quote:
Race Numbers. Participants shall plainly display their race numbers at all times, and shall maintain the race number in an unaltered, unobstructed and readable state at the start and finish gates, in the transition areas, and on the course
Some officials get hungup on the "unaltered" portion of the rule and frown if you trim a number sticker so it fits better on your bike. As I've explained, the purpose of the rule is to prohibit folks from changing their number in such a way that they can not be properly identified on the course. If I do nothing more than trim the excess material but my assigned race number is still clearly identifiable I'm following the rules. I've yet to be penalized for doing this and it's come up mutliple times.
Btw, I've never made that iPhone argument and I probably would never try. There's too much room for abuse on that one and I can see the official not trusting you to not turn on some tunes once you're out on the bike course.
p.s. I'm a lawyer as if that was hard to tell.
Re: Computer on IPhone [logella]
[ In reply to ]
It is much easier for a RD to say no than deal with all the what ifs. I can see the day they do allow smartphones that there will be people taking selfies and posting them to Instagram while attempting to ride their bike at the same time.
Rodney
TrainingPeaks | Altra Running | RAD Roller
http://www.goinglong.ca
Rodney
TrainingPeaks | Altra Running | RAD Roller
http://www.goinglong.ca
Re: Computer on IPhone [rbuike]
[ In reply to ]
I'd find it hard to believe a device named iphone (which includes the word 'phone') can be considered to sometimes not be a personal communication device.
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Re: Computer on IPhone [trycrzb]
[ In reply to ]
I asked this specifically at a tri I ran this summer- the interpretation of the rules by the organizer was that one could not use the iPhone as a personal audio device. The fact that it has that capability is not the problem, but actively using it in such a manner would be. So as long as you weren't using headphones or playing music through the speakers, no problem. It was a USAT sanctioned race so, while I understand there is some ambiguity in the interpretation of the rule, that is how they read it and I think it seems reasonable.
I used my phone in the race, but had it in the saddle bag feeding the info to a Wahoo RFLKT. That approach makes it not so obvious your using you phone, and also keeps the phone out of harms way and lets you instead use a much smaller, waterproof screen that drains that battery much less. I'd highly recommend that, and it works fine with Strava, although you can use the Wahoo App to customize the data fields.
I used my phone in the race, but had it in the saddle bag feeding the info to a Wahoo RFLKT. That approach makes it not so obvious your using you phone, and also keeps the phone out of harms way and lets you instead use a much smaller, waterproof screen that drains that battery much less. I'd highly recommend that, and it works fine with Strava, although you can use the Wahoo App to customize the data fields.
Re: Computer on IPhone [Cobble]
[ In reply to ]
Cobble wrote:
personal communication deviceWhat are you asking about a personal communication device? There's no such thing referenced in the USAT rules.
Re: Computer on IPhone [Spillicus]
[ In reply to ]
Spillicus wrote:
I asked this specifically at a tri I ran this summer- the interpretation of the rules by the organizer was that one could not use the iPhone as a personal audio device. The fact that it has that capability is not the problem, but actively using it in such a manner would be. So as long as you weren't using headphones or playing music through the speakers, no problem. It was a USAT sanctioned race so, while I understand there is some ambiguity in the interpretation of the rule, that is how they read it and I think it seems reasonable.So you essentially made the argument that I stated above and were successful. Congrats. Glad to hear they had some common sense.
Re: Computer on IPhone [Cobble]
[ In reply to ]
Cobble wrote:
I'd find it hard to believe a device named iphone (which includes the word 'phone') can be considered to sometimes not be a personal communication device.You obviously don't use AT&T.
ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)
Re: Computer on IPhone [Spillicus]
[ In reply to ]
Spillicus wrote:
I asked this specifically at a tri I ran this summer- the interpretation of the rules by the organizer was that one could not use the iPhone as a personal audio device. The fact that it has that capability is not the problem, but actively using it in such a manner would be. So as long as you weren't using headphones or playing music through the speakers, no problem. It was a USAT sanctioned race so, while I understand there is some ambiguity in the interpretation of the rule, that is how they read it and I think it seems reasonable. I used my phone in the race, but had it in the saddle bag feeding the info to a Wahoo RFLKT. That approach makes it not so obvious your using you phone, and also keeps the phone out of harms way and lets you instead use a much smaller, waterproof screen that drains that battery much less. I'd highly recommend that, and it works fine with Strava, although you can use the Wahoo App to customize the data fields.
+1 on the Wahoo app; much better. Just use it to upload to Strava when you're done.
ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)
Thanks all, I will ask the RD or a rules person at the day before shindig thingee. I'll get one of two answers.