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Retro TT stuff
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jeremyb
Jan 11, 10 13:57
Post #1 of 631
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Retro TT stuff
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The Chrissie article got me to looking more at old technology. Funny how some of this technology (like fairings behind the headtube) were prevalent over 20 yrs ago but then disappeared.
The aerobars are obvious, but look at the fork---
looks a lot like an Argos
http://www.flickr.com/...9/in/pool-648649@N22
http://www.flickr.com/...1/in/pool-648649@N22
http://www.flickr.com/.../in/pool-648649@N22/
http://www.flickr.com/...9/in/pool-648649@N22
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BMANX
Jan 11, 10 14:06
Post #2 of 631
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Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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Ah you have to love the PRE ITU BS.
Bikes were so much better to look at back in the day.
AERO & LIGHT is RIGHT
Cervelo SLC 5890g/12.98 lbs.
Old Scratch
Jan 11, 10 14:09
Post #3 of 631
(40374 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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I think this is 1998:
Quintana Roo Redstone
1 Reviews
3 Quick Ratings
4.50 of 5
Rate it! 1 - worst 2 3 4 5 - best 1 2 3 4 5 Rating Distribution new Array(0,0,1,0,3);
Description
Redstone (#7005 aluminum) Aero-shaped carbon-fiber gussets. >QR's tri geometry including 78" seat tube angle >Carbon-fiber gusset >Carbon stabilizer diminishing rear triangle flex >TIG welded of ...
(This post was
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by Old Scratch on Jan 11, 10 14:12)
BMANX
Jan 11, 10 14:12
Post #4 of 631
(40365 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [Old Scratch]
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If I have the time to work with carbon at home, I would do something similar with my P2K frame.
AERO & LIGHT is RIGHT
Cervelo SLC 5890g/12.98 lbs.
Old Scratch
Jan 11, 10 14:14
Post #5 of 631
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Re: Retro TT stuff [BMAN]
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One more:
[/img]
jeremyb
Jan 11, 10 14:14
Post #6 of 631
(40352 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [Old Scratch]
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Funny to me that this bike looks so crazy-cool-custom, and then generic Profile extensions that dont match the red/white/blue paint. Check out the aero cranks.
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djciii
Jan 11, 10 14:16
Post #7 of 631
(40349 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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Love that front wheel..that is awesome
----------------------------------------------------
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act, but a habit.
http://biggintriathlete.blogspot.com/
jeremyb
Jan 11, 10 14:18
Post #8 of 631
(40344 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [djciii]
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In Reply To:
Love that front wheel..that is awesome
Scirocco's
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Dbeitel
Jan 11, 10 15:12
Post #9 of 631
(40261 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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Jeremy
I actually have a road version of the Cinelli Laser that you picture. Its a dual disc with a 650 in the front. Right now it is geared with a 54 big ring and a straight block 11-15. Only time I ever had it in the big gear is down hill. Scared the **** out of me ! Passing cars with nothing in front of you !!
DB
hblake
Jan 11, 10 15:20
Post #10 of 631
(40241 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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Those Corima aerobars are hideous.
paul_tx
Jan 11, 10 15:35
Post #11 of 631
(40214 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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That nice couple in the first pic very certainly ahead of their time.
Titanflexr
Jan 11, 10 15:43
Post #12 of 631
(40186 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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In Reply To:
Funny to me that this bike looks so crazy-cool-custom, and then generic Profile extensions that dont match the red/white/blue paint. Check out the aero cranks.
These were the USA Team Olympic track bikes ('92 I think). I never could understand the design; if you were going to save drag by omitting one tube, why remove the top tube?
__________________________________________________
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
jeremyb
Jan 11, 10 15:56
Post #13 of 631
(40154 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [Titanflexr]
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In Reply To:
In Reply To:
Funny to me that this bike looks so crazy-cool-custom, and then generic Profile extensions that dont match the red/white/blue paint. Check out the aero cranks.
These were the USA Team Olympic track bikes ('92 I think). I never could understand the design; if you were going to save drag by omitting one tube, why remove the top tube?
Totally agree. Maybe Bio_McGeek or Andy can shed some light....
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jeremyb
Jan 11, 10 16:14
Post #14 of 631
(40126 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [Old Scratch]
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In Reply To:
One more:
[/img]
This Max Lelli
(which I think is a Chinese TT bike re-badged---
though that's the subject of another thread
) looks a lot like that Redstone.
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gregclimbs
Jan 11, 10 16:22
Post #15 of 631
(40114 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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In Reply To:
In Reply To:
These were the USA Team Olympic track bikes ('92 I think). I never could understand the design; if you were going to save drag by omitting one tube, why remove the top tube?
Totally agree. Maybe Bio_McGeek or Andy can shed some light....
I can think of about two or three reasons...
:D
g
greg
www.wattagetraining.com
Bio_McGeek
Jan 11, 10 16:31
Post #16 of 631
(40095 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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Two words: Chet Kyle. When EDS started what eventually became Project 96 we were going in the direction of the Zipp 2001. We were in conversation with Andy Ording at Zipp about having custom versions made. Also, had various prototypes made in steel by Dan Wynn. There was a guy from the San Diego area who was making extremely stiff custom carbon bean bikes (made one for Arron Hartwell) and these ideas were all on the table. When Chet got involved in the project all he wanted to do was build this bike, which was essentially a slightly updated version of a prototype for 1986 or so. You can find pics of the original moc-up in one of the old Cycling Science articles. No amount of wind tunnel data would convince him that there were better designs.
Chet also would not entertain ideas regarding changes in rider position. No steep seat tubes even though it was legal then. Also, we knew about the superman position but Chet and Ed Burke would not give it a chance. Superman position was a well kept cycling secret but one of the engineers at GM, a guy named Bill Surber found a picture of superman position being tested in an Italian language aerodynamics journal. I still have the xeroxed picture he gave me in a box somewhere. Could we try it with the US cyclists? No way.
Cheers,
Jim
In Reply To:
In Reply To:
In Reply To:
Funny to me that this bike looks so crazy-cool-custom, and then generic Profile extensions that dont match the red/white/blue paint. Check out the aero cranks.
These were the USA Team Olympic track bikes ('92 I think). I never could understand the design; if you were going to save drag by omitting one tube, why remove the top tube?
Totally agree. Maybe Bio_McGeek or Andy can shed some light....
jackmott
Jan 11, 10 16:36
Post #17 of 631
(40083 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [Titanflexr]
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lets you have a front wheel 'cutout'
frees up head tube shaping options, and that is the most important bit on the w hole bike
top tubes do still add drag, even on a velodrome, yaw isn't 0 the whole time there either
In Reply To:
These were the USA Team Olympic track bikes ('92 I think). I never could understand the design; if you were going to save drag by omitting one tube, why remove the top tube?
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BMANX
Jan 11, 10 16:52
Post #18 of 631
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Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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AERO & LIGHT is RIGHT
Cervelo SLC 5890g/12.98 lbs.
(This post was
edited
by BMAN on Jan 11, 10 16:53)
jeremyb
Jan 11, 10 17:48
Post #19 of 631
(39978 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [Bio_McGeek]
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In Reply To:
Two words: Chet Kyle. When EDS started what eventually became Project 96 we were going in the direction of the Zipp 2001. We were in conversation with Andy Ording at Zipp about having custom versions made. Also, had various prototypes made in steel by Dan Wynn. There was a guy from the San Diego area who was making extremely stiff custom carbon bean bikes (made one for Arron Hartwell) and these ideas were all on the table. When Chet got involved in the project all he wanted to do was build this bike, which was essentially a slightly updated version of a prototype for 1986 or so. You can find pics of the original moc-up in one of the old Cycling Science articles. No amount of wind tunnel data would convince him that there were better designs.
Chet also would not entertain ideas regarding changes in rider position. No steep seat tubes even though it was legal then. Also, we knew about the superman position but Chet and Ed Burke would not give it a chance. Superman position was a well kept cycling secret but one of the engineers at GM, a guy named Bill Surber found a picture of superman position being tested in an Italian language aerodynamics journal. I still have the xeroxed picture he gave me in a box somewhere. Could we try it with the US cyclists? No way.
Cheers,
Jim
Awesome! Thanks for the personal insight thats really cool.
Just saw
you can purchase all of the Cycling Science articles on CD
shipped from Mr. Kyle himself. I think I'm going to go order it.
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R10C
Jan 11, 10 18:13
Post #20 of 631
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Re: Retro TT stuff [Bio_McGeek]
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Didnt a few of those get stolen from a hotel hallway never to be seen again? Lon Haldeman had some one off WAY back in the day that had some weird ass brand on it but seemed to be about identical to the GT (then the Zipp came out...blah blah blah..)
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You put your right leg in, you put your right leg out, you put your right leg in and you shake it all about.
Bio_McGeek
Jan 11, 10 18:21
Post #21 of 631
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Re: Retro TT stuff [R10C]
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In Reply To:
Lon Haldeman
R10C
Jan 11, 10 18:24
Post #22 of 631
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Re: Retro TT stuff [Bio_McGeek]
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I prefer to remember Lon on his Kestrel 4000 thanks ;-) (Oh, with a bungee cord from his hemet to the back of his seat)
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You put your right leg in, you put your right leg out, you put your right leg in and you shake it all about.
jeremyb
Jan 11, 10 18:33
Post #23 of 631
(39891 views)
Re: Retro TT stuff [Bio_McGeek]
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My all time favorite. Check out the depth of the blades on the fork. Apparently, this is not the exact bike Boardman rode.
http://www.flickr.com/.../4012704666/sizes/o/
The other side:
http://www.flickr.com/.../3597376510/sizes/l/
http://www.flickr.com/.../3912239447/sizes/l/
The road production version is a little different:
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(This post was
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by jeremyb on Jan 11, 10 18:57)
jeremyb
Jan 11, 10 19:15
Post #24 of 631
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Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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1984 Olympic team bike
http://www.firstflightbikes.com/olympic.htm
From People magazine
August 06, 1984
Vol. 22 No. 6
http://www.people.com/.../0,,20088394,00.html
Maybe It Looks Funny, but Chester Kyle's New Olympic Bike Could Turn Out a Winner
"It's the greatest thing since the invention of the wheel," exults U.S. Olympic bike racer Roy Knickman, 19. "No other country will have anything to compete with it." The U.S. team calls it the "funny bike," but the new machine's performance is no joke. Pared to streamlined perfection the U.S. team's super-cycle may well help it ride off with a clutch of medals in the team and individual pursuit and 100-km team time trials at the L.A. Games. If it does, it will be partly with thanks to the aerodynamic wizardry of Chester Kyle, 55, the engineer and inventor who oversaw the bike's bizarre design. Deadpans Kyle, "So far it hasn't slowed them down any."
A professor of biomechanical engineering at Cal State Long Beach, Kyle has been pushing the speed limit for bicycles since 1973, when he first demonstrated that some 80 percent of a rider's energy goes into fighting wind resistance. His present generation of bikes, costing up to $20,000 apiece, were created by his six-man design team to weigh as little as 11 pounds. The frame tubing is made from a super-light alloy, cast teardrop-shaped with blunt end forward to slip through the air. All holes, which create drag by stirring up turbulence, were plugged or smoothed over. Spoked wheels can be replaced with plastic Kevlar disks.
Racers will wear Kyle's skintight suit, and the whole rig will be topped off with a swept-back helmet that makes the rider look—and fly—"like a missile," says Kyle. "Theoretically in a four-and-a-half-minute race," he adds, "the bicycle with the helmet, shoes and suit could save 11 or 12 seconds." In races where fractions of a second usually determine victory, that's a big margin.
The bike's unusually small, 24-inch diameter wheels also help. For example, in the team pursuit (a high-speed chase around the cycling track in which opposing four-man teams race over 4,000 meters) the tighter wheels allow riders to stay closer to one another and better use the leader's slipstream. "I don't think the bikes are intrinsically faster," says racer Brent Emery, 26, "but they allow you to sit closer and recuperate faster. The faster you recuperate, the faster you ride when you lead the pace line again." Steve Hegg, 21, a dark horse in the 4,000-meter individual pursuit, is more enthusiastic. "The bike's a big improvement," he says, "and Kyle's skintight suit is great."
A cyclist himself, Kyle founded the International Human Powered Vehicle Association, which sponsors an HPV race each year at the Indianapolis Motor Speedway. "At first it was a joke," he says. "Now, with the energy shortage and the Olympics, people aren't laughing anymore." Indeed the speediest HPVs—low-riding, three-wheeled, streamlined pods called Vectors—have exceeded 60 mph on sheer pedal power. But the technological edge alone won't win races. Says Steve Hegg, "It's still the team riders that count in winning medals."
Original article:
http://www.scribd.com/.../Chet-Kyle-1984-Bike
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(This post was
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by jeremyb on Jan 11, 10 19:47)
R10C
Jan 11, 10 19:47
Post #25 of 631
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Re: Retro TT stuff [jeremyb]
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Can you however tell us who made the frames?
(Oh, I know I know I know!)
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You put your right leg in, you put your right leg out, you put your right leg in and you shake it all about.
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