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Slowtwitch Forums: Triathlon Forum:
Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA

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1712

Sep 28, 09 11:37

Post #1 of 29 (1110 views)

Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA	Can't Post

I would like to get some IM Moo course information. All feedback is welcome. How does the IM Moo course compare to the IM CDA course? Thank you.

Mac

Sep 28, 09 11:41

Post #2 of 29 (1096 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [1712] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I can't say specifically...but do a search on this forum. There is lots on this topic.

Rokko

Sep 28, 09 11:58

Post #3 of 29 (1073 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [1712] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Both have some rolling hills. I think CdA is a little bit easier of a bike course. The pavement is better, and not as many sharp corners and hills. Prettier too IMHO (I prefer trees and lakes to farmland. Not saying farmland is ugly, just saying).

CdA bike course can be divided into thirds - first third is flat to small rollers (T1 through Higgins Point to Hayden Lake). Second third is an out and back of rolling hills (beyond Hayden Lake). Some of the hills will make you use the small chainring. None are very long, and none of them will kill you. There are some great downhills too. The third third is again basically flat as you reenter Hayden Lake and Cda. Then do it again for the scond lap.

Moo bike course felt like everytime you get comfortable cruising, there was either a sharp corner or an uphill. And all of it had a headwind. Hills weren't too bad though. There is achallenging one or two, with some wild fans. I enjoyed as the fans close in on the course, because i figured it was as close to racing up Alp du Huez in the TDF as I'll ever get. Fans were loud and close. And playing tubas. No where else other than Wisconsin have I ever seen tuba playing fans. That's a good thing.

CdA bike course is easier for your fans, as the bike passes right thru town a couple of times. Moo the bike heads out of town, does 2 laps, then returns to town. So if the family wants to see you ride, they have to figure out transportation to the bike course.

The CdA run is mostly flat as it is right along the water. Not that Moo's run is overly hilly, but it has slightly more elevation. CdA has great run support as you pass thru town. Moo has incredible fans, especially in the shopping/restaurant district by the campus (sorry don't recall the street name). Overall I would say the runs are similar enough that it's not a big deal.

Swim courses are both pretty much flat. CdA water may be a little cooler, but it ain't no big thing. Both are 2 lap. Moo is a swim start and continuous swim, CdA is a beach start and short beach run between the laps.

Town spirit I give to CdA. It seems like the whole town, and Hayden Lake, are all super excited by the IM. Parts of Madison are, but it's also a college town and students are just returning (and 1st home football game), and business goes on, and so forth. So community spirit I give to CdA.

Overall they are really similar IM's. You can't go wrong with either
-----

Blazeman Warrior - so others may live
Live more than your neighbors.... Bark at the moon like the wild dog that you are.... And by all means, whatever you do, get it on film.

WiScott

Sep 28, 09 12:04

Post #4 of 29 (1059 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [Rokko] [In reply to]	Can't Post

"Swim courses are both pretty much flat."

I don't think you'll find anyone disagreeing with that assessment!

-Scott

1712

Sep 28, 09 12:20

Post #5 of 29 (1028 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [Rokko] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Excellent review. Thank you. I completed IM CDA in '08. Keep hearing how IM Moo bike course is soooooooo much more difficult. Just wanted to get perspective from someone who had done both.

goldenboy

Sep 28, 09 12:27

Post #6 of 29 (1015 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [1712] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I'm not suggesting I'm an expert here but for IM #1 I did IMCDA, for IM #2 (two weeks ago) I did IMMOO. Here's a summary of my thoughts on both...

Overall and in all disciplines (including T1/T2) I think IMMOO is harder.
Swim - IMMOO has 7 turns around the buoys, IMCDA has 4. I personally think though that the beach start at IMCDA is harder than the deep-water start at IMMOO.
T1 - Run up the Helix at IMMOO vs. just run up the short beach and into the tent at IMCDA.
Bike - IMCDA is easily broken down into manageable pieces and sections where you can really dial in a cadence and pace and smooth out your power. Hills are steeper but fewer. Rollers and sharp turns at IMMOO make it challenging to be consistent.
T2 - Ride up the Helix and run down and out the long parking structure at IMMOO. Takes more time.
Run - Potential for hotter conditions at IMMOO. It seemed like there were more turns, technical sections and up/down at IMMOO. I liked IMCDA a lot better. Long sections along lake CDA to again, allow you to dial in the pace and be consistent.

Logistics, parking, etc. - IMCDA hands down is better. Park your car on the street and walk a short distance to the transition area. Traffic in CDA is pretty manageable. IMMOO is in the concrete jungle of Madison. Parking is a circus before, during and after the race.

I guess I liked IMCDA better.

Rokko

Sep 28, 09 14:06

Post #7 of 29 (956 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [goldenboy] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I agree with Goldenboy, except for maybe the run being hotter in Moo. CdA has had some hot conditions too (2004 I think was in the 90's). I think both CdA and Moo have the ability to have extreme heat, bitter cold rain, and everything in between. On the same day.

Goldenboy hit it right on with traffic, parking, and logistics.

Overall I also prefer CdA, but Moo is also a great race.
-----

Blazeman Warrior - so others may live
Live more than your neighbors.... Bark at the moon like the wild dog that you are.... And by all means, whatever you do, get it on film.

baxnelly

Sep 28, 09 14:11

Post #8 of 29 (950 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [1712] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I've done IMOO twice and my friends have done IMOO a couple of times and did CDA last year. Between them (they are a husband/wife) they have bout 17 IM finishes and have done all but Canada and Arizona.

They got into CDA because she was the Janus Hometown Hero in 2007 and got free entry. The absolutely loved the race, said they would not have gone or signed up for it but the free entry offset some of the travel costs. When they got back last year all they kept saying was how nice the whole thing was.

They also loved IMOO for flat out the best crowd support in all the races they've done, and they also said in their opinions that the CDA bike course was much, much easier than IMOO.
________________________________________

http://kktriblog.blogspot.com/
http://www.thedamtri.com

RockChalk1406

Sep 28, 09 14:39

Post #9 of 29 (924 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [1712] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Many people here will discredit the use of a Garmin 305 to measure vertical feet climbed, but I did IM CDA this year and my girlfriend did IMMOO this year and the same Garmin was ued for the bike section.

On my device IM MOO registered about 18 more feet of climbing than CDA.

For what it's worth....
Tim
2010 - Kansas Marathon, Kansas 70.3 & IM Louisville

goldenboy

Sep 28, 09 15:32

Post #10 of 29 (887 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [Rokko] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Good points from Rokko. Agree on the weather...pretty unpredictable in either location.

Can't overstate though what a challenge it is (and draining physically/mentally) to deal with the traffic and logistics at IMMOO. At CDA registration I parked a couple of blocks (tops) from the tent, walked to the park, progressed from table to table to register in less than 10 mins. On race morning I didn't need my wife to drop me off at transition because we parked on a residential street about a 3 min walk from the park. Cake.

Everybody told me that crowd and volunteer support was amazing at IMMOO. I think it is amazing in most venues. I really couldn't tell if it was better than CDA.

1712

Sep 28, 09 16:29

Post #11 of 29 (859 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [goldenboy] [In reply to]	Can't Post

It is hard for me to believe that crowd support at any venue could be better than CDA. The way that community embraces that race is absolutely incredible.

fasterthanTIM

Sep 28, 09 17:48

Post #12 of 29 (827 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [1712] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Also did CdA in 08 and IMOO this year. IMOO bike course is not that much harder. You just have to be careful on not go out too fast. I had lots of people passing me during the first 40 - 50 miles and past twice as many in the 60 - 70. There are a few more hills that you we want to spin up in IMOO, but fairly similar. I think IMOO run is easier. IMOO water was much warmer. (Also too warm)

Rokko post is great regarding fans and support along the two courses. Both are nice courses and my only IM races, but I too like the lakes over the corn fields. I have worked at IMFL and both IMOO and IMCda are superior to IMFL.
Lisa Walser-Anderson, ATC,CSCS

hammered1

Sep 28, 09 20:55

Post #13 of 29 (778 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [fasterthanTIM] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I did IMCDA (my first) & watched IMMOO (I live in WI). I will do IMMOO next, I did fine at IMCDA but now want to go fast and was not ready to in June with no races behind me at IMCDA. That said IMCDA was in the 50's & 60's where as IMMOO was in the 80's & most likely will be every time.

jacknine

Sep 28, 09 21:04

Post #14 of 29 (775 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [Rokko] [In reply to]	Can't Post

CdA surely cant compete with Moo when it comes to the ambient aroma on the bike

(This post was edited by jacknine on Sep 28, 09 21:11)

Rokko

Sep 28, 09 23:46

Post #15 of 29 (758 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [jacknine] [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To:

CdA surely cant compete with Moo when it comes to the ambient aroma on the bike

Smells like Dairy Air!

jacknine

Sep 29, 09 6:20

Post #16 of 29 (714 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [Rokko] [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To:

CdA surely cant compete with Moo when it comes to the ambient aroma on the bike

Smells like Dairy Air!

LOL

Lar Dog

Sep 29, 09 6:43

Post #17 of 29 (692 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [jacknine] [In reply to]	Can't Post

IMOO 3X
CDA 1X

Both great venues

Fan support is unsurpassed at IMOO; not even close. If you like a lot of cheering people, IMOO. Both bike courses are tough and both reward a dose of patience on the 1st loop
Lar Dog

lulu

Sep 29, 09 7:28

Post #18 of 29 (668 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [Lar Dog] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I'm wearing my IMOO hat as I write this. IMOO, IMOO, IMOO, IMOO, IMOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

lulu

nothing focuses the mind like a death sentence

bluemonkeytri

Sep 29, 09 8:10

Post #19 of 29 (651 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [1712] [In reply to]	Can't Post

CdA was my first IM, Moo my second. I have spectated couple times at Moo, and been able to ride and run the course there a number of times. Caveat, when I did CdA, it was the old bike course, and the race was relatively new. That being said, I would do CdA before Moo. Loved the town, the lake was pristine (although the swim start was crowded). Moo's bike and run course are harder (or maybe it was just the basically 100 degree heat we were in). Weather seems to be a bit more unpredictable at Moo. CdA more of a destination, Moo is in a college town. Madison is a fun town, but we just love the Pacific Northwest (if CdA is still considered that, it certainly has that feel).

www.momslasagna.org, because Every Bite Saves a Life.

goldenboy

Sep 29, 09 8:23

Post #20 of 29 (638 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [bluemonkeytri] [In reply to]	Can't Post

If you want a really relaxing time, pre and post race the choice is pretty easy...CDA. Easy to get to driving or flying. Minimal traffic to deal with. Scenery and surrounding area is amazing.

David in NY

Sep 29, 09 8:57

Post #21 of 29 (614 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [fasterthanTIM] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I also did IMCDA in '08 and IMMoo in '09. While I did 4 minutes faster on the bike at Moo (5:16 vs. 5:20), I would say that Moo is a little harder. In addition, Moo has more miles of slow riding due to the bike lane and helix things. My guess is that a similar effort at both courses with similar weather would yield 5 minutes slower at Moo.

Rokko

Sep 29, 09 9:50

Post #22 of 29 (574 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [1712] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I haven't done any other IM's to compare them to, but my guess is CdA and Moo are probably the two most similar IM events out there. If I were to choose which one to do next, it wouldn't be based on the challenge of the course. I would decide on things like season (June vs September), logistics to get to the race, which state I'd rather go to, and (most importantly) which one the wife would agree to me doing.

You can't go wrong with either. It comes down to personal preference.
-----

Blazeman Warrior - so others may live
Live more than your neighbors.... Bark at the moon like the wild dog that you are.... And by all means, whatever you do, get it on film.

meganruns

Sep 29, 09 16:49

Post #23 of 29 (506 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [1712] [In reply to]	Can't Post

My buddy did both (CDA last year, IMoo this year). He said CDA is much easier on the bike than IMoo. One big hill at CDA, much more technical course at IMoo.
-----
Follow me on Twitter! megankillian
http://www.endurancemeg.com

cat

Oct 16, 09 13:38

Post #24 of 29 (397 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [meganruns] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I did IMCDA and thought it was a very hard course. Many unrewarded downhills, meaning you have sharp 90degree turns at the bottom of many of the downhills. Other than the out and back at the beginning, you are either descending, cornering or climbing. Very hard to get in a groove. Ialso did IMLOU and thought that course was easy, just rolling and not technical at all. I am also thinking about doing IMMOO. I am not as concerned about the hills as i am about technical component. I am more of a runner and cornering and power surges are not my specialties. Can anyone proved more info as to how technical this course is? I am also interested to hear how the swim at IMMOO compares to IMCDA(temp and chop). I tought IMCDA was one of the hardest swims on the circuit. Very choppy and cold. Beautiful venue, but hard race!

intransition

Oct 16, 09 13:56

Post #25 of 29 (376 views)

Re: Info about IMMoo vs. IMCDA [cat] [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To:

If you thought it was hard to get into a groove at CDA, I'm afraid you'll encounter more of the same at IMWI. It's a fairly technical bike course--lots of turns, climbs, descents with cornering, etc. There are very few sections where you can stick in a gear and hammer away for miles on end. This is part of what makes it such a great course--it clearly separates those who have hill trained from those who haven't. As for the swim, water temps won't be cold; if anything, they can border on being too warm. Chop is a day to day call, so it's hard to say what you'll encounter. The times I've raced IMWI, the water has been slightly warm but pancake flat.

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