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Fall Running Challenge Sep 14-Nov 14
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devashish_paul
Nov 2, 09 18:12
Post #351 of 431 (491 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [caffynator]
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OK, 13 days left in this challenge. I just looked at my total and hit 500K today. Next week is a taper week for Clearwater, but I'll get in 23K on race day with my warmup. That means I have to do 77K over the other 12 days to hit the total. Should be feasible despite next week being taper week. I suppose I did more mileage than expected while on biz travel last week and the week before doing 60-90 minutes daily.
Today's workout was run over to soccer field, then 10x100m accelerations (50 m jog recovery) + 200m @10K race pace (100m jog recovery). Pretty cool doing it in the dark under moonlight.
Dev
www.kestrelbicycles.com |www.infinitnutrition.ca | www.nineteenwetsuits.com
Free camps: Whiteface Hill Climb + Epicman Lake Placid 3k/180k/21k June 10/11 2010
bmanners
Nov 2, 09 18:29
Post #352 of 431 (482 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [devashish_paul]
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56.5 miles left for me.Rode the bike today . Felt great avereged around 19.5 mph for 30 miles while not pushing to to hard. Knees feel a bit sore still from last weeks 62.5 mile week or is it because I should have retired running shoes? Using a new pr. tommorow though my superfeet insoles re 1 years old. Time for new ones there also. Ended up just under 8 minute mile average for last week. Last two runs killed the average. Spin class and 6 mile run tommorow. Shame looks like a nice day and no babysitter for the 5 year old so stuck inside unless gramama stops by. Fingers crossed!
devashish_paul
Nov 2, 09 18:41
Post #353 of 431 (477 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [bmanners]
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Can I ask why you are running with superfeet? First of all, those things are pretty generic...secondly they are not training your feet to be stronger and self support. To me it is like outside assistance and eventually the structure above the feet will exceed the strength of the foundation (feet) and the building will topple. My 2 cents on this topic.
Dev
www.kestrelbicycles.com |www.infinitnutrition.ca | www.nineteenwetsuits.com
Free camps: Whiteface Hill Climb + Epicman Lake Placid 3k/180k/21k June 10/11 2010
Chris G
Nov 2, 09 18:51
Post #354 of 431 (471 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [devashish_paul]
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superfeet are just insoles right? how are they really different than the insoles that come in all shoes?
FWIW I have never used them and know nothing really about them other than people that sell them try to sell me on them regularly.
hgrong
Nov 2, 09 18:54
Post #355 of 431 (470 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [Chris G]
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superfeet are just insoles right? how are they really different than the insoles that come in all shoes?
FWIW I have never used them and know nothing really about them other than people that sell them try to sell me on them regularly.
Yeah, they are insoles. Dev is just an elitist when it comes to running and believes that if you cannot run a marathon barefoot, then you should not be running. IIUC, anything more than racing flats are "outside assistance" in his opinion. Obviously I am exaggerating a little . . . but only a little.
devashish_paul
Nov 2, 09 19:03
Post #356 of 431 (468 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [hgrong]
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Hah....calling a 37 minute guy an elitest is like calling a guy with a 220W FTP or 80 second 100m swim an elitest :-). I think you need to be sub 29 open runner or sub 31 tri runner to even have any elitest credentials :-)
They are not "just insoles" they are poor fitting orthotics. At least if you want orthotics, get ones that are made for your specific foot structure.
www.kestrelbicycles.com |www.infinitnutrition.ca | www.nineteenwetsuits.com
Free camps: Whiteface Hill Climb + Epicman Lake Placid 3k/180k/21k June 10/11 2010
hgrong
Nov 2, 09 19:10
Post #357 of 431 (459 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [devashish_paul]
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Hah....calling a 37 minute guy an elitest is like calling a guy with a 220W FTP or 80 second 100m swim an elitest :-). I think you need to be sub 29 open runner or sub 31 tri runner to even have any elitest credentials :-)
Man, I have sooooooo far to go to live my elitist dream. I am just trying to get to a 36 open by next summer. But in my defense, I didn't start running until last fall. I am just a running newbie, I don't get to be elitist even in the unlikely even that I get fast.
bmanners
Nov 2, 09 19:27
Post #358 of 431 (449 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [devashish_paul]
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Dev,
When I started the 100 run last year
I was 30 pounds heavier, 6 months before that I
was 20 pounds heavier then that. I was running and started getting plantars fascitis (spelling?). I am Freinds with a Doc and he actually told me to save 600.00 bucks and give them a shot. They worked well and with some massaging and few days off all was well. Do you know what it is like running into or climbing to the roof of a burning building in the middle of the freezing night and you can hardly put any weight on a foot. While your team is counting on you to also bring up a chainsaw and to carry your own weight till the roof is opened and the fire is out so everyone goes home safe. I do it!!! sucks! Or I could just say they worked and offered more support then regular soles that came with them.
devashish_paul
Nov 2, 09 19:36
Post #359 of 431 (445 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [bmanners]
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OK, I hear what you are saying, and understand where you are coming from. Here is my thought. If you are running to the point that your body is giving you some issues, its better to cut back on running till the bad stuff clears up and work on strengthening the suspect weak links rather than keep pushing through with outside assistance.
In the long tern doing more miles x intensity than what your weakest link supports will not lead to a positive outcome. I can pretty well guarantee that after hanging out with runners of different types, and abilities for 30 years. Better to figure out how to fix the weak link. Just giving them support will not strengthen.
If you need the superfeet to do your job, go to town with them. But if you need them to do recreation (running), think twice about what they are letting you get away with. I know, we all want our big macs we want them now and we want to jump to the front of the line...that's the McCulture we live in. This approach to life does not apply to running (at least in the long term). My 2 cents. Feel free to throw that out.
Dev
www.kestrelbicycles.com |www.infinitnutrition.ca | www.nineteenwetsuits.com
Free camps: Whiteface Hill Climb + Epicman Lake Placid 3k/180k/21k June 10/11 2010
bmanners
Nov 2, 09 19:47
Post #360 of 431 (442 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [devashish_paul]
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They have worked for over a year. What should I do then ? What should I do to strengthen my feet to not use then If that does not work could I hurt myself to the point where I lose weeks or more running. Because of YOUR challenges I can run a 20 min. rolling 5k in high winds and stinging rain. Think could have went under 20 in right conditions. Point is I do not want to lose that. 3 years ago I was lucky to break 28-30 min. I thought i fixed the weak link. They are over a year old so at this point I do not know if they actually are still supporting anything. Dev I do not eat at mcd's for the last 4 years. Go to chik' filet now.
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saltman
Nov 3, 09 7:43
Post #361 of 431 (422 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [devashish_paul]
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Outside assistance? Are these any different than wetsuits, aero bars, aero helmets, etc....
devashish_paul
Nov 3, 09 7:54
Post #362 of 431 (419 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [saltman]
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wetsuits, and aerobars won't make you physically weaker to the point of getting injured.
Bmanners, you can look up a variety of exercises on the web for strengthening your feet. It is awesome that you have lost 50 lbs over this time and are ripping up the run speed. With 30 years of running under my belt, I'm just giving you some warning to look after your feet. There is no free lunch over time. You might have short or medium success with some outside assistance, but all weak links need to be fixed for long term longevity.
Look at TC....she did all that running on treadmill to the point of overdeveloped hip flexors and weak glutes...again....not looking after the weak links and relegated to the hurt locker. Everything has to exist in some form of balance. You can't have parts of your body way stronger than the weaker elements that are critical to support.
Do what you guys want with this information/hot air.
Dev
www.kestrelbicycles.com |www.infinitnutrition.ca | www.nineteenwetsuits.com
Free camps: Whiteface Hill Climb + Epicman Lake Placid 3k/180k/21k June 10/11 2010
saltman
Nov 3, 09 8:12
Post #363 of 431 (414 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [devashish_paul]
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I thought you were suggesting he was cheating. I agree, that better to allow your body to adapt.
devashish_paul
Nov 3, 09 8:20
Post #364 of 431 (412 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [saltman]
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No, not cheating wrt to performing in races....but cheating yourself by not developing a balanced body and "masking the weak links" with external aids. I do believe that orthotics (like crutches) have their place in helping one get over accute cases of a variety of injuries, but once passed the accute stage, we need to fix what is broken (rather than continuing to use the crutch for support).
burnman
Nov 3, 09 8:37
Post #365 of 431 (404 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [devashish_paul]
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There's a time and place for biomechanical assistance, but I have to agree that recreational running (and rec sports as a whole) are not it. Performing job duties, and day-to-day activities are a more appropriate venue, but you're right about the McWorld syndrome. We're all guilty of wanting things done faster, cheaper, easier, etc. without much regard for the long term expense.
I am guilty of utilizing inserts and motion control sneakers in order to to 'assist' my rehabilitation several years back. Now, I'm at the point where I'm faster but simultaneously weaker as a runner. I've tried to incrementally reduce my reliance on the unnatural geometry of my sneaker/insert combination, but it typically results in excessive discomfort and (like a moron) I'd rather be running than hurting. I still do my physical therapy to stay flexible and strong, but the hidden weakness that lies between my feet and the ground is still unattended. Sadly, my biggest goal for running this winter is to rid myself of all inserts and overcompensating shoes, and getting into something more natural.
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Hunting is only a sport if your prey is human and he shoots back.
Gary Mc
Nov 3, 09 9:08
Post #366 of 431 (401 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [devashish_paul]
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I just hit 400K this morning and I have a 100k week planned. So provided it all goes well I will hit 500k before the challenge is over.
This challenge has really motivated me at the exact time of year that I usually flake out. I am doing the High Desert 50k on Dec. 6th and I have never had this much volume or distance in my training.
This week I will be doing 50 miles over 4 days as follows:
Friday 10 miles rolling
Saturday 15 miles hilly trails
Sunday 15 miles very hilly trails
Monday 10 miles flat to rolling
I got this workout from an ultra runner friend. The logic being that keeping the runs under 15 miles will allow me to recover easier and still get in the miles. We'll see how it goes.
Gary Mc
www.xterrasnowvalley.com
tigerchik
Nov 3, 09 13:13
Post #367 of 431 (384 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [burnman]
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Lookit what I have for water running:
They are water running shoes with little fins to give you a better "push off" so it is closer to your natural stride. Borrowing from a friend, hopefully will have time to try them tomorrow.
the thing is I get in the pool and I want to swim!
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mmm, pi!
bmanners
Nov 3, 09 14:41
Post #368 of 431 (369 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [Gary Mc]
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Nice looking plan god speed with it. I have 12 to 15 planned for 2morrow. Ran 6 today on treadmill in 39min 45 sec. mostly at a 9.1 mph pace at a 1% incline. Walked after hitting 6 miles for a quarter of a mile. I did not log walk as per rules set by Dev. Also Dev did not use my superfeet insoles. I have crappy ones in that came with shoe. Since it is a Asics 2140 and offers me stability tell me again how by not having the superfeet insoles in there that my feet are goingn to get stronger ? Not kidding around would like a little explanation. I do not want to hurt myself after all the work put in. Actually I care less with being hurt, its losing my speed and endurance that would hurt most. I kind of like pain to a point.
bmanners
Nov 4, 09 13:18
Post #369 of 431 (338 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [bmanners]
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17 miles today in 2 hrs 21 minutes and 20 seconds. Did not use the orange insoles. Around mile 14 feet started to hurt a bit. Pushed through it and finished run. Polar watch said 17 miles but if my bike comp is correct is should have been 18. Lots of sizeable hills in run and I ran them in reverse of what I usually do . Seemed to hurt more in a good way. three more 6 mile runs a day off then 5 - 6 milers and a 12-18 miler planned . What do people normally do long run ? Before day off , after day off or in the middle of week and get best results ?
DEV I HEAR YOU.
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tigerchik
Nov 5, 09 6:11
Post #370 of 431 (312 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [bmanners]
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quite jealous of all your running.
Ran 0.25 mi this AM, still had pain, think I am making a massage appt to see if that helps any.
53 min bike.
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mmm, pi!
tigerchik
Nov 5, 09 11:21
Post #371 of 431 (299 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [tigerchik]
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20 min water running, all the pool time I had today.
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mmm, pi!
instigator
Nov 5, 09 12:10
Post #372 of 431 (287 views)
Re: Fall Running Challenge Sep 14-Nov 14 [devashish_paul]
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Was wondering if any thought was given to holding a challenge between the end of the Fall and the start of the 100/100 on Dec 15? I need some motivation to get my runs up for the 100/100 and the winter running season.
bmanners
Nov 5, 09 14:10
Post #373 of 431 (276 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [tigerchik]
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6 miles on dreadmill no stiff neck problems and knees feel good. Think I waited a week to long to switch to new shoes. Nice blister on side of foot from doing a 17 (18) mile run in said new shoes. No long runs planned till next week so all's good.
tigerchik
Nov 6, 09 16:23
Post #374 of 431 (251 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [bmanners]
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2k swim + 40 min bike today.
I also got a massage and the therapist worked out a kink (ie REALLY TIGHT MUSCLE) in my hip. Maybe tomorrow, I will have happy hips and be able to run!
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mmm, pi!
GrumpyCloth
Nov 7, 09 3:45
Post #375 of 431 (230 views)
Re: Falling Running Challenge ???? [tigerchik]
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man props to you top peeps for really putting in the miles..dear lord...
Funny fact:of the top10 only 4 by my count are doing something other then running..not to take anything away from them,just thought it was intresting
Dev is an animal..glhf in fla
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